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EU extradition on demand undermines justice - Telegraph.co.uk

EU extradition on demand undermines justice Telegraph.co.uk, United Kingdom - Sep 13, 2008 That measure will be a threat to the liberty of law-abiding Britons even if every EU country had uniformly high standards of justice. ...

EU extradition on demand undermines justice - Telegraph.co.uk Just how effective can be gauged from a measure passed by the European Parliament two weeks ago, which our own Government has just endorsed. Well, yes - but as the preamble to the new regulation states, the right itself is "not absolute". So EU bureaucrats, lawyers and parliamentarians have concluded that it can be dispensed with when doing so increases "efficiency".And indeed, it is unquestionably very inefficient to have all those pesky protections for people who are accused of crimes. They prevent the state from convicting people swiftly and cheaply. No trial in absentia can be fair, and the procedure can only be justified as a last, desperate response to the most exceptional and severe conditions. Standards vary enormously across Europe: the courts in some of the former Eastern bloc countries, such as Bulgaria and Romania, do not observe the same protections for those accused of crimes as courts in Britain. A study by the EU itself found that corruption in Romania is rife, and that the "Romanian anti-corruption effort keeps evaporating". He was detained in Romania on that charge for three months. His alleged victim can not be traced and did not appear or give evidence at any court hearing. In November 2004, he was released and required to leave Romania within five days - which he did.In March 2007, he received an email from the British embassy in Romania informing him that the Romanian courts had held a trial which had convicted him in absentia of sexual abuse. The court had sentenced him to seven years in prison - a sentence that had been confirmed on appeal. The Romanian government issued a European Arrest Warrant, and the British man was sent back to Romania. After another trial which lasted less than one hour, and at which the alleged victim was again not present, the seven-year sentence was confirmed. The Briton is now in prison in Romania - where he will stay until he has served his sentence.That case is not a piece of spurious anti-EU propaganda: it actually happened. Not one of the EU's existing "guarantees" made the slightest difference - and the new law will sweep away even those. Baroness Scotland, the Attorney General, has insisted that the new law will reinforce "a fundamental cornerstone of British justice". If she is right, then "British justice" is being transformed, under the bogus rubric of "combating the threat of terrorism", into a system that has all the protections and all the integrity of the Romanian or Bulgarian variety. High Treason has been committed and they must be brought to account and face the consequences.That the leader of Her Majesty's Opposition has been deafeningly silent on this matter, confirms his tacit approval of it. Now I might have an arrest warrant, trial in Austria in absentia etc. At present I live abroad and am married to a foreigner and have a new kid- I love the UK so does the wife. I can no longer rely on UK as a home.I'm now actively seeking to emigrate to Australia. I left UK 12 yrs ago and likely won't return, this is one of the reasons you see so many indiginous British leavning too.When UK reaffirms its commitment to its citizens, and leaves EU(SSR) / Franco Prussian Empire / 4th Reich will I come back. In the meantime if you have skills there are many countries that are far more democratic willing to take you, places that you can feel a part of that country. I want to be part of a country that I can be proud of Again. Posted by ariel on September 14, 2008 12:55 PMReport this commentMan On Waterloo. It is the mind control page on my site click my name...Posted by Life on September 14, 2008 12:41 PMReport this commentWhy am I not suprised at this eroding of justice? Get out of the EU now and stop immigration, indeed lets get rid of a large number who are already here, illegals, criminals etc. Reverse this bloody so called multicuturalism and stuff the EU.Posted by PKenny on September 14, 2008 12:36 PMReport this commentWhat I find amazing is that any of our readers are surprised by this. It has been the subject of many UKIP letters and warnings for the last 8 years. Now, despite their efforts to persuade the UK not to vote for the pro-fascists in the 2 main parties, we have it. We have only ourselves and our ballots to blame. Only a revolution will save us now.Posted by Roger Brady on September 14, 2008 12:33 PMReport this commentWhat I cannot understand is how 'supposedly' intelligent men!!!!!! I am appalled at the UK accepting this after one thousand years of common law which put the accused first.I feel that the decimation of the House of Lords was a prime example of destroying the British ways so that these unsound laws can then replace centuries of experience. The old House of Lords will never have rubber-stamped this insane Corpus Juris.Good job my parents did not live to see what has happened to the country they chose to live in for its sanity and safety!!!! And that was before any handouts at all.As usual, Dara.at 1.27am speaks nonsense!Posted by claudina apicella( damned labour, out of EU! A review of Baroness Scotland�s career points you very strongly towards understanding why such laws come into being. Patricia Scotland is one of Gordon Brown�s political appointments and what we get is a mediocre lawyer specialising in family law and political correctness, at least she fits in with the rest of the cabinet. As for reinforcing a fundamental cornerstone of British Justice, this seems contrary to several clauses of Magna Carta, Article 10 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and Act 6 of the European Convention on Human Rights. But, what should we expect?Even though the malicious report on the Irish referendum says that the people did not understand the treaty, I suspect that �did not understand� is a euphemism and the Irish people guessed (correctly) what it meant in practice. Does it harm you in any way?If you don't like it, look the other way. The answer is to just get us the f*** out of this institution we never voted for, never wanted, and have distrusted for years. Only once bricks start going through Whitehall windows and the police start getting a touch of the poll tax scaffold pole treatment and the fires start burning down Whitehall will there be the start of a movement for change. We don't want it - but what else is going to make any difference? Time to don the holey balaclava and angle grind a CCTV camera for freedom. Better still poke an MP and ban him from your local bar.75% of the country want a referendum on continued membership of this EU. CAMERON WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT?The British have been told long enough. Time to cause some real mayhem in Brussels instead perhaps. Take a hamburger out of the mouth of a passing MEP and give it to the dog as a fitter beneficiary.Without anger this is never going to take off. You can either round people up, put them on trains, drive them off to a secluded forest destination and gas them OR if you wish to be subtle, you can do what the EU is doing to us.The EU is fundamentally about genocide.Something to think about. Posted by John McInnes on September 14, 2008 11:43 AMReport this commentLindsay Jenkins @ 10:22 AM - "What will Cameron do? He says he is sceptical of more powers passing to Brussels. I now have no confidence that Cameron will do anything about preventing more powers passing to Brussels, recovering powers, fundamentally re-negotiating our relationship with our European neighbours, or anything of the kind. When he was first elected as Conservative leader, I was very willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. Now I can draw up a list with at least half a dozen good reasons why he can't be trusted over the EU. Posted by mehmet ali on September 14, 2008 11:40 AMReport this commentWhy should anyone be surprised. The EU is destined to be the new Fourth European Reich ( German politicians now openly boast about this) which will do away with all forms of freedom, justice,democracy and the legal safeguards that we have enjoyed in Britain for centuries. This is the very thing we were fighting against in the 1940's ~ so why are our British politicians not fighting against it now? Did all those brave souls in the second world war die in vain? The piece of EU legislation removes any suggestion of national borders or rights pertaining to a nation state and its citizens. To sign this away so casually is rather shocking. We have long had bipartite extradition with almost every state involved here - this new law simply removes the need for a case to be made - before trial - to move a citizen from state A to state B. Is that what this enables?Posted by simon coulter on September 14, 2008 11:14 AMReport this commentOur so-called leaders have agreed to this so for now we have to live with it. If we want to be rid of it then we must get out of the EU which is my wish. Outside the EU the question of extradition will remain. As I understand it under English law it was necessary for a foreign prosecutor to provide prima facie evidence to an English court that a crime under English law had been committed. A judgement can go through normal appeal channels. This process has also been set aside by the extradition treaty with the USA which was intended for terrorist suspects but is used for what the USA considers economic crimes. There may be other instances.We should return to our own legal system. This is being interpreted, as a means to place Moslems, by allowing child marriage (itself, child sexual abuse) to become the 'norm' throughout Europe by no longer facing the stigma of being regarded as criminal. Not simply on the internet edition of the readers' comments. We are now subject to every law already 'passed' in every EU country and any they care to cook up today, tomorrow, the day after. None will have been passed by the UK parliament.The EU too is developing its own civil code and criminal code. Those in favour of the EU will argue that our MEPs will have agreed to them - well it willnt matter if they voted yes or no: their voices are in a minority.We are indeed in a dangerous fascist state - dangerous to each and every one of us. And to which the Labour gvoernment has agreed.What will Cameron do? Goodness me!Posted by Lindsay Jenkins on September 14, 2008 10:22 AMReport this commentAll we want to know is why European countries particularly Great Britain allow CIA EXTRAORDINARY RENDITIONS at our airports. Denied by Home Secretary Jack Straw at the time. Some of these detainees were sent to Guantanamo Bay and tortured. The British government has stated that CAMP DELTA contravenes international law. Conclusion: Laws only apply to US citizens..like Californian student John Walker Lindh caught in Afghanistan with the TALIBAN in 2001...no human rights for "foreign suspects". We need some consistency across Europe when the CIA kidnaps Arab "terrorists" off the streets of ROME....like the Israeli nuclear scientist in London? I DID NOT KNOW THAT YOU COULD BE TRIED WITHOUT BEING PRESENT. OR WITHOUT THE VICTIM BEING FOUND .WHY IS THAT MAN IN PRISON IN ROMANIA UNDER THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES ? A shame the author repeats the calumny, however: the text approved by the European Parliament EXPRESSLY requires the individual to have been notified of the forthcoming trial, in a language s/he understands, in time to arrange a proper defence. The author, however, repeats the claim that such a trial can occur without the individual knowing about it.Could we have some journalism rather than prejudice on these pages?Posted by Rob on September 14, 2008 9:57 AMReport this commentGraham Watson is a traitor, and my MEP. You live in a fascist Soviet collective and it is going to get a whole lot worse.New Statewatch Report: The Shape of Things to Come by Tony BunyanlinkThe EU is currently developing a new five year strategy for justice and home affairs and security policy for 2009-2014. The proposals set out by the shadowy "Future Group" set up by the Council of the European Union include a range of highly controversial measures including new technologies of surveillance, enhanced cooperation with the United States and harnessing the "digital tsunami". In the words of the EU Council presidency:"Every object the individual uses, every transaction they make and almost everywhere they go will create a detailed digital record. It shows how European governments and EU policy-makers are pursuing unfettered powers to access and gather masses of personal data on the everyday life of everyone � on the grounds that we can all be safe and secure from perceived "threats". The EU envisages the territory of the member states of the Union as a single legal area with delegated prosecutors based in all the member states. The implications for our legal system and individual rights are immense. The EU's own official book, Corpus Juris, makes this clear. Quote:"What we propose is a set of penal rules. The prosecutorial rules and powers are repressive: CORPUS JURIS PROSECUTORIAL POWERS 1) "Powers of investigation of the European Public Prosecutor (EPP) "will include g) To make requests for a person's remand in custody. This means that the EPP can incarcerate someone for months without charge merely because he thinks they might have committed an offence or might commit an offence. It appears that there is no limit to the number of 3-month extensions. There are no jurors, simple or otherwise. Your rights, held since Magna Carta are no more.Quotations from Corpus Juris (ISBV 27178/33447) Treat yourself Alasdair to this scary book or put 'Corpus Juris' in your search engine. What really scares me though Alasdair is the ignorance of our MPs and journalists as to how we are now governed. Posted by Val Cowell on September 14, 2008 9:44 AMReport this commentThis article is late, at least 12 years too late. See eg:"Tampere Summit Conclusions, 15 - 16 October 1999", reproduced here: link"The European Council held a special meeting on 15 and 16 October 1999 in Tampere on the creation of an area of freedom, security and justice in the European Union ... The European Council is determined to develop the Union as an area of freedom, security and justice by making full use of the possibilities offered by the Treaty of Amsterdam. It is patently without any semblance of balance. As written it allows no explanation of the real picture. I trust the DT/ST will quickly allow for someone who wants to inform rather than indoctrinate to have similar access to the readers. Once again we are asked by the DT/ST to believe that every government in the EU have agreed something that is either mad or corrupt. The tragedy is that some fools actually believe it.Posted by PRW Richardson on September 14, 2008 9:02 AMReport this commentJeez, I really want to leave this country and travel to our so called "partners" countries. Please tell me that I am safe not leaving the UK? Please tell me that they cannot wisk me away and lock me up without me actually having visited one of these charming countries? Magna Carta stopped atrocities such as these in Britain 800 years ago, we must congratulate the Labour government for turning the clock back. You are holdong out a real hostage to fortune here.The moment our government asks for the extradition of a DT hate-figure is the moment this is put to the test.I will come out with it Mr Palmer, I am honest. You are here:Telegraph>Opinion>Personal ViewContact us | Forgotten your password?